did you Forum Guru's not read the blurb on being a forum guru? according to point 3 you ARE suppose to be doing moderation.
3. As a guru you are expected to follow all publicized forum rules, and enforce those rules within the threads you participate.
Yes, all gurus have been presented the caveats prior to accepting the added status. Along with the added status, it is expected they will enforce the rules within the threads they participate. Moderators are called upon to enforce rules upon all threads that they see requiring moderation, even threads they are not otherwise involved in.
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well moving the post out of the thread takes away all the context of my post. You might as well delete this new thread
The post seemed remarkably ill-placed amid the thread offering congratulations to new moderators. But it was also a comment worth noting, which is why it was moved. Since your comment seems to makes its own point, I'm sorry if you feel it is diminished by being set on its own. I would disagree, it's as meaningful here as it was there, such as it is.
It's not that it's diminished, it has no context. Perhaps you can't see that because you saw it in the original context, but try coming to it fresh - it makes little sense. Ignoring the high handed attitude of moving it in the first place with seemingly no warning or explanation, your last comment is both condescending and self-contradictory in my opinion.
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As Andy appears disinterested in furthering his thoughts or adding back in context at this point, I will honor his last words and delete this thread shortly.
I think you meant uninterested. Disinterested means impartial or unbiased.Not sure why he should have to reinstate the context that you removed.
I think I broke this rule yesterday. I'm called a Guru and therefore am supposed to follow all the rules for threads I post in. I worked on a question yesterday and posted my answer. As I looked at the answer I saw a FM had found it was a cross post and I was breaking a rule by posting an answer after a warning???
We have lots of rules to follow. How about focusing on trying to help others learn and use Excel? Isn't that the reason for having this forum in the first place?
I think rules are only for those who follow them. I'm finding more and more people who don't know the rules and are breaking them from ignorance of them or simply trying to get things done without knowing what they are. Can we share our knowledge about Excel on this site or do we need to go elsewhere? BTW - I've found YouTube to be a great tool for sharing Excel questions and answers.
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It does seem odd that some members, including mods, respond to threads citing a violation of some rule, then proceed anyway to give a not very great answer, and then conclude by saying that no one else may respond -- enshrining marginal advice.
Or links a cross-post, which arguably leaves the OP with no response necessary if it were the only one, unless there is an unspoken expectation of prostration and self-flagellation. Meanwhile, the thread is on life support waiting for someone to find the advance directive to pull the plug.
A little more consistency would likely be appreciated by all.
Last edited by shg; 09-14-2013 at 03:33 PM.
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I have a great sympathy with Marvin's last comments. I went away from this forum for 2 or 3 years after seeing an array of officiously worded laying down of the rules to new posters.
My own attitude to seeing an infraction is to send a kindly PM to the poster. This almpst always works.
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Maybe, as not being a forum expert, I'm not supposed to enter this discussion, but I do feel the urge to respond.
I think it is pretty blunt to just move Andy's post apparently without taking the pain of consulting him first. Regarding Andy's value to the forum that would be only courtious.
As rule 6a says: "....When perceived errors occur point them out politely via private message ...." it looks like JDBeaucair is on the edge of breaking this one. Though this rule targets moderators explicitely I think it applies to all members with a value like Andy's.
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Amidst a thread of people taking the time to congratulate and wish well the new moderators, Andy's non-congratulatory comment taking an understandable jab at the idea that all Gurus are defacto moderators seemed ill-placed. It is moved here for all to disgruntle to their hearts content, because at the root of the jab is a kernel of truth, such as it is.
So, it is not deleted, it is moved and look, all sorts of joyous disgruntlement follows. All moderation is bad, you'd all do it better, yes, of course. No one complains about things they like, so that's my sour grapes to sort out.
Moving it to this thread took away the context? I don't know that I agree that that is the result, even NOT being in a thread congratulating new moderators, it's still pretty obvious in post #1 that Andy doesn't like the "enforce the rules in the threads in which you participate". Anyone not get that? But it is again a moderation event, so it's something more to dislike.
I agree, SHG, and I'll bring that up in the Moderator's forum. If any response is being given in a thread along with a "fix this rule" comment, either fix it yourself and leave a reminder or exclude the Excel answer, both is confusing and leaves others with no legal way to correct or amend the suggestion given if it is in error or ill-conceived. It's a good point and will be reiterated.Originally Posted by shg
I've loved this forum since the day I joined and I hated the heavy-handed way the rules were banged on people's heads all over the place. But they were the rules so I stayed out of it and answered Excel questions. First as a moderator and now as an Admin my first approach to 99% of moderation is to simply fix the thread to make it rule-compliant and point it out to the OP rather than "locking" a thread with a comment-rule they must reply/change something before someone can respond. It's my opinion it's a friendlier approach, and some of the comments above seem to support that belief.
====================
Andy, I have always respected you and your contributions. The LAST thing I ever plan to do is offend or appear condescending, I choose my words carefully and usually do a good job of making things clear. In moving this thread it was my belief that it was not a good contribution to the congratulatory thread in which it was placed, but it was a valid thought of yours and moved here to preserve it. I understand you do not like that I did that, but I hope at least in the small background you understand why I did it. I do apologize for not introducing the reason for this thread until post #4, that was an error. But I do not believe it would have much changed the discourse that has followed.
These non-Excel events and discourse are a main fodder of disagreement and I detest that. People like you I've long admired, and in the past I'd hoped at least respected my contributions, now are given easy methods of being unhappy and it ends up being on my doorstep. Threads like these are exceedengly disheartening.
Deleted by bvj
Last edited by protonLeah; 09-20-2013 at 07:21 PM.
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@JB,
Since there's no context, I can't be sure, but I think you totally misunderstood this. I don't think it was a jab at anything. There were several people making comments about the new mods taking on extra responsibilities and Andy just pointed out that the responsibilities were already there.
Everything else flowed from your action but personally I don't see any of your old favourite "joyous disgruntlement". The other comments seem pretty disinterested to me.
As romperstomper points out my post was about the guru's acknowledging the difficult and thankless task of forum moderation and being grateful they did not have to do it.
I was simply pointing out that according to the rules they agreed to, by taking guru promotion, that they should be.
Yes, agreed. My post #2 was intended to address that thought. Gurus are expected to enforce rules in the threads where they participate. Moderators must do much more than that.
Agreed. I thought I was being mindful of the purpose of the original thread and supportive of Andy by setting this "thought" apart to be discussed separately. It clearly did not come off that way, and for that I am sorry.Everything else flowed from your action but personally I don't see any of your old favourite "joyous disgruntlement". The other comments seem pretty disinterested to me.
But it wasn't a thought for discussion - it was a response to one or two other posts. Removing it from those posts was at best nonsensical. And your post #2 introduced the idea that it was a jab.
The apology in post #17 will have to suffice. It explains my reasoning and apologizes for failing at my goal.
Unless you enforce forum rules do not moderate anything without consulting the poster first.
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