# Off Topic > The Water Cooler >  >  "I need a macro that is so simple it could be written with the macro recorder...."

## BellyGas

"but I'm too lazy to use it."

Seeing more and more of these lately.  This thread is my vent at lazy gits who want their work done for them with no brain engagement required.  If you want to learn how to code VBA I'm more than happy to help, anyone who shares my love of logic loops and other geeky things is more than welcome to pick my brains. However, if you want things done for you with no effort on your part then......hire a VBA developer.  I'm a VBA developer and my daily rate is around £350.  Hint frikkin hint.

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## BellyGas

Heh.  30 something views, half a dozen new stars added to my rep with comments like "Bravo" and "Amen"......but no posts in the thread?

It's getting worse ya know.....

http://www.excelforum.com/showthread.php?t=1097500
http://www.excelforum.com/showthread.php?t=1097493

Actually, I could paste in links to threads that start with "I want" from now until sunday....

Why do these people seem to think this forum is where developers hand out solutions for free?  Why does no-one tell them to bugger off and speak to their finance dept for a budget?  Why do some people actually reply to these lazy cheapskate morons?  Why do so many people think they can get an easy solution without having to learn anything?

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## BellyGas

P.S.  It is becoming more and more difficult to resist the urge to respond to every "I want" thread with a link to the commercial services forum.  I may need to take a break from the forum for a while....

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## Kyle123

It irks me too, but I simply don't bother helping (unless it's a question that piques my interest), I think it's because the type of users who post on these forums generally have very little idea how much work is involved or even where to start - it's a general office forum it's not Stack Overflow, there's no requirement to try yourself or show what you've done, if you don't like it move along; There are threads that I won't even look at based on the title - pretty much the threads that are simply "GIV ME DA CODEZ", you get the hang of spotting these a mile off. 

You'll also come across people who post frequently that I'm pretty sure offer their services on online sites, "sort my spreadsheet for a fiver", freelancer etc without actually having the knowledge to do so, if you want to wind yourself up a bit more take a look here: http://www.excelforum.com/search.php...vBForum_Thread  :Wink:

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## Kyle123

> P.S.  It is becoming more and more difficult to resist the urge to respond to every "I want" thread with a link to the commercial services forum.  I may need to take a break from the forum for a while....



Then don't, simply don't reply  :Wink:

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## Doc.AElstein

> ..., if you want to wind yourself up a bit more take a look here: http://www.excelforum.com/search.php...vBForum_Thread



At least he "stays real".....





> .......You'll also come across people who post frequently that I'm pretty sure offer their services on online sites, "sort my spreadsheet for a fiver", freelancer etc ......



.
.  I expect many people register with a new made up name and e-mail address every time they want a question answered and so avoid people like you "sussing them out".. Not sure how true that is here, ( haven’t checked out the statistics of the “one Thread poster members”.. ) but at another Forum I am in that accounts for well over half of the Members. It ‘aint allowed but i expect a “Blind Eye” is turned to get the member quota up....

Alan

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## Doc.AElstein

> P.S.  It is becoming more and more difficult to resist the urge to respond to every "I want" thread with a link to the commercial services forum.  I may need to take a break from the forum for a while....



Hi,
.  I actually fully agree with your sentiments, - after about a year here and at other forums learning VBA with about 2000 posts in Total, well over half answering rather than asking for help..( often even answering my own, at least partly!! )  )  - .  I t gets to the point that when / If you are not learning too much more, than it can get a bit frustrating by the Threads of the type you were moaning about. For that, ( and for reasons of needing to concentrate on my own project), I am reducing my forum activity considerably now..
.  What is very frustrating as well is that when, as I am, still inexperienced, it is often only the less technically challenging but time consuming Threads that are left to answer as the very experienced members here snap up the rest with a speed that amazes me. – For every Thread I ever answered, I had a about 2 almost finished which I give up on as a Profi comes in with a much better solution. 
.  I was wondering if there is some way to know if an OP is getting “special treatment” as a result of paying, or of it is possible to know when a pro has an unanswered  Thread well in Grip so that I do not waste my attempting an answer??  
.  Having said that, the Threads I most learnt from were those with lots of different solutions, especially when one solution did came from me ( when my attempt was not dismal enough for me to submit it ! ), - It is a great motivation to see and learn from how a Profi does it better, once you have struggled with it yourself...

...........................
.  It is certainly a very debatable issue you have raised.
.
 Alan


. P.s – the last thread you criticised from danfullwood, is exactly the sort of Thread I have usually been able to / left to answer in the past. Except mostly they were considerably bigger and more complicated!!!, and I had a big struggle initially to get the OP to produce  reduced sample data as danfullwood has already done.  So I may be tempted to have a go at that one, as a “quicky” ( relatively speaking for the Threads I have answered of that nature!!)... 
....You did me a favour... As you replied it is not shown as an unanswered thread, so A profi will not snap it it up away from me!!!... It is a Funny World!!!!!  
. P. P.s . I wish i could earn £350 a Day  from computing. I am working privately on zero budget on an important personal project. I actually find VBA programming fun sometimes. Never occurred to me that one could get paid so much for doing it !!!

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## FDibbins

> Why do these people seem to think this forum is where developers hand out solutions for free?



Pretty much because it is  forum where members (developers or not) hand out solutions for free  :Smilie: 

Nobody is obligated to respond to any thread from any member here, we all do so because we want to.  I am sure most members here have come across a thread that has "pushed their button", and the advice to them is always - if you dont like it, dont reply/respond, just move on the next thread where, perhaps, your help will be more appreciared.

This rant (and I mean that in a good way) raises it's head periodically - you are not the 1st, nor will you be the last -, and it can be good to let off a bit of steam now and then.

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## FDibbins

> P.S.  It is becoming more and more difficult to resist the urge to respond to every "I want" thread with a link to the commercial services forum.  I may need to take a break from the forum for a while....



With only 69 posts, leaving would hardly be taking a break?

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## GeneralDisarray

> With only 69 posts, leaving would hardly be taking a break?



Oh snap!


This made me wonder - what do the more common posters on here do for a living??  I've literally built my current job from cruising forums like this - answering other peoples questions helps LOADS.

First, comparing your solutions to those of the page-1 members (and others, but you know... the real gurus...) is great for improving your standard methods, and making sure you don't get so narrow minded that you miss something worth knowing.

BUT, many, many times someone has asked a question that leads me to figure out something I didn't know was possible - which I immediately apply to something sitting on the back burner at work.

Seriously - single phrases uttered here have led to complete breakthroughs in projects in my real life....


---
Yes OP - I feel your pain - why can't the whole world just be competent, hard working, ego-checked, code monkeys with a natural love of all things logical?  I guess it's just not meant to be...  :Frown:

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## Tony Valko

> what do the more common posters on here do for a living??



I'm "semi-retired".

Worked at a plant on Neville Island. Worked as a quality control lab tech where we used spreadsheets extensively. This is where I learned most of my formula skills.

Later worked as a shift supervisor where we used spreadsheets mostly for stuff like inventory control and making employee schedules.

I was just randomly surfing the web one day (many years ago) and landed on a Microsoft help forum. I've been very active in various Excel help forums ever since.

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## GeneralDisarray

I guess I should answer my own question:  I work in oil-field service in the USA - operations side of things.

My work is focused on connecting SQL and Excel to handle daily reports from field employees, and also to get data from SQL to Excel for management type reports.  Spend most of my time in VBA editor and the Sql-Server-Management-Studio.

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## Doc.AElstein

.  I am not really a common poster, at least not in this Forum. Just learning VBA ( and computing for the first time!! ) for a personal project since about a year or two.

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## FDibbins

GD and Tony, you guys may be neighbours?  Im not that far away either (Altoona)

I am an Industrial Engineer by training, used excel often on projects.  Now am a security guard at a vets home (long story, dont ask lol)

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## Doc.AElstein

> ......Now am a security guard at a* vet*s home *(long story, dont ask lol)*



.*.. love of Dogs ?*

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## FDibbins

Yes, I do love dogs, but this is a veterans home  :Wink:

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## Tony Valko

Hey, I'm a veteran.

You just might end up guarding me one day!  :EEK!:

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## Doc.AElstein

> ......
> 
> You just might end up guarding me one day!



... I am saying nothing..

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## BellyGas

> With only 69 posts, leaving would hardly be taking a break?



 :Smilie: .  lol.  Indeed.

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## BellyGas

> P. P.s . I wish i could earn £350 a Day  from computing. I am working privately on zero budget on an important personal project. I actually find VBA programming fun sometimes. Never occurred to me that one could get paid so much for doing it !!!



If I ever manage to get a foot into the finance industry then the very next contract will be in London for £550 a day.  However, those gits in banking always want experience and don't seem to appreciate that VBA is still VBA.  Mind you, the other day I found out a program manager at the place I'm currently contracting got the push cos she basically did bugger all all day.....and the project now had an extra £850 a day budget available.  !!!!.   I'm in the wrong racket....

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## cyiangou

And what's with this newbie compulsion to split data all the time? I spend enough time gathering external data into a coherent, queryable dataset. Why on earth would I want to separate it into sheets?

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## BellyGas

Oops, double post.

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## BellyGas

> Pretty much because it is  forum where members (developers or not) hand out solutions for free 
> 
> Nobody is obligated to respond to any thread from any member here, we all do so because we want to.  I am sure most members here have come across a thread that has "pushed their button", and the advice to them is always - if you dont like it, dont reply/respond, just move on the next thread where, perhaps, your help will be more appreciared.
> 
> This rant (and I mean that in a good way) raises it's head periodically - you are not the 1st, nor will you be the last -, and it can be good to let off a bit of steam now and then.



Yep.  See.....where I'm coming from is sorta like this:  I learned VBA the hard way, I'm self taught and I'm still hoping to learn more every day.  I seem to have a flair for UI design though, and so the things I do in Excel generally look the business and....as I'm sure you're aware, users go "coo" over the simplest things if they look nice.  This, and a certain amount of luck, landed me my first VBA dev contract a few years ago and I've been lucky enough to keep finding contracts ever since.  And yes there is a lot of luck involved cos I've had the kinda contracts that allow me to play with computers making them do flashy things rather than just number crunching or supporting other peoples code, we're talking proper app dev from requirements gathering through to deployment.  I get to imagine how things should be....and then make it so.  I have THE BEST ****ing job in the world.

I tell ya, if I had access to the source code I really would change the world.  And there's a lot of people who'd be in some serious s**t too.

But anyway, digressing.  As I say, I've worked hard and been very lucky.  There's a lot of other people around who also want to learn, to work at it, to gain the ability to imagine how they want it to be...and make it so.   And I respect that, more than you can imagine.  And so, if someone wants to learn I will happily, gladly, willingly help them.  And there are more who have learned but haven't got the experience to be able to land a decent contract / job......but are quite capable of providing services for small 'fix my spreadsheet' jobs and could, possibly, make a few quid out of their talent.......if these damn lazy cheapskates didn't keep getting solutions for free. ;-).

I'm oversimplifying I know, it's just for comedy effect.


Lemme tell ya a quick story.  That first dev contract I had was for a huge company who outsourced pretty much all their IT to an Indian company.  Once my app was complete they were contracted to provide ongoing support of the users (around 2000, spread all over the country). I am willing to admit I was not impressed with them in the slightest and so, to illustrate my concerns to the boss, I created a fake support situation at one of the remote offices.  A few hours later a section of my code was posted in this very forum with a request for a 'code fix' by an Indian chap.

Ahem.

And they were charging £30,000 a year for this support.

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## FDibbins

I take your point, and Im sure this happens to some greater of lesser degree on here, as well as other forums.  We are not going to stop it, even if we wanted to.

Bottom line here is that, no matter what your view, background, preferences etc, this remains a free forum, where members come for free assistance - be that "teach me to fish" or just plain "catch a fish for me".  If someone is not comfortable answering a question, move on...that simple - I have done that more than once

Judging by the kind of questions being asked, I would say that probably by FAR the greatest number of posts here are business-related, it's the nature of the beast.  Would I like to get paid for what I (love to) do?  Sure.  Will I stop helping here and a few other forums, if I dont get paid?  Not a chance, thats not why I am here, not why the majority of members are here.

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## xladept

I've learned a lot on this forum - when I see a thread that I'm interested in but don't have a clue, I subscribe to it. Although many go unanswered, some get answered and I learn.  Also, if I've worked up a solution to a thread I always post it whether or not someone else has answered(well, almost always) :Smilie: 

I'm a retired School Teacher and Excel Programmer/Developer but looking for work :Smilie:

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## quekbc

Interesting, I was starting to ask myself what most of the posters that primarily give solutions here do for a living. I'm a financial modeller (by chance) and visits this site from time to time for a short distraction and to see if there are any interesting topics to look into.

This post also answer my other curious thought as to why some posters have such high frequency of questions yet the questions seems to be completely unrelated to one another.

Definitely learnt heaps of things here. Until recently I didn't know what CSE stands for...

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## Glenn Kennedy

... and I'm a sort-of self-employed consultant in areas relating to analytical chemistry and EU regulatory affairs.  I've learned a pile on the EF in the last year or so; but it *can* be a bit time consuming.    Having said that, I expect to be here a lot in the next week or so as I'm on a business trip to a  country with a serious security problem.  My hotel is a bit of a fortress, so there's not much to do in "down time".  There isn't even a bar where I can take refuge...

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## judgeh59

I'm an Inventory Analyst for a large contract manufacturing company. I work in the purchasing/materials department. My job title isn't really what I do though. I'm really a data miner. I use SQL to dig out data from JDE/Oracle. I use TOAD sometimes, Rapid Response, XL, PL/SQL and a few other things. I use XL/VBA to automated the heck out stuff. I do about 190 standard report throughout a QTR that are all automated. That does not include one offs. I do have an IT background (IT Manager for 5 years,20 years in SysAdmin/Network Admin). I love what I do because I learn something everyday and I work with great people. I'm extremely lucky.

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## GeneralDisarray

\_0.0_/

Perfect example... I totally just learned a whole to way to do something I've literally done 1000's of times...

http://www.excelforum.com/access-tab...onnection.html

Seriously ... I'm glad I visited that thread again and spent half an hour researching what the F he was talking about.... MIND = BLOWN

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## Doc.AElstein

........





> ...... I expect many people register with a new made up name and e-mail address every time they want a question answered and so avoid people .... "sussing them out".. ....



..................





> I'm "semi-retired".
> Worked at a plant .....







> .... I work in oil-field service in the USA - ...







> GD and Tony, you guys may be neighbours?  Im not that far away either (Altoona).....I am an Industrial Engineer.....)







> ........
> I'm a retired School Teacher and Excel Programmer/Developer but looking for work







> .......... I'm a financial modeller (by chance) .......







> ... and I'm a sort-of self-employed consultant in areas relating to analytical chemistry .........







> I'm an Inventory Analyst for a large contract manufacturing company. ......



.. Maybe this Thread should be re titled "Outing" of the "real" people

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## quekbc

> Maybe this Thread should be re titled "Outing" of the "real" people



And the problem being....?

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## Doc.AElstein

> And the problem being....?



. ? .... no problem. I meant it positive..   ....my criticism was aimed at the Anonymous "one Threaders”:
Post #6
http://www.excelforum.com/the-water-...ml#post4154066

 . " keep it real man "
 :Smilie:

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## quekbc

Haha, I understand now. Brain needs time to warm-up.

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## FDibbins

> ........
> 
> .. Maybe this Thread should be re titled "Outing" of the "real" people



Yes, it kida has got way off track from the OP's topic

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## quekbc

Another slightly off-topic, anyone noticed how the "type" of questions seems to come in waves? I remember, last week or so, there were quite a number of posts on calculating hours for different type of shift work. I can't remember other specific examples, but I do notice this pattern from time to time.

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## Doc.AElstein

> .... anyone noticed how the "type" of questions seems to come in waves?.....



  .  Homework from a big class of students? - One student has sucess at the Forum so passes it on to his class mates?

.    At another Board I am on it was noticed that at certain Symester Starts that a lot of the "One Threader", Funny Name poster's were about

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## Kyle123

I thought that questions come in subject waves too, but I can't make my mind up whether this is objective or subjective. I don't know if I'm seeing patterns that aren't really there, if I read a couple of questions that are similar I tend to spot more similar ones - but I'm not entirely convinced that means that there are waves or my brain is making connections, much like when doing a word search. I've never cared enough to run the analysis though...

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## Jacc

> Another slightly off-topic, anyone noticed how the "type" of questions seems to come in waves? I remember, last week or so, there were quite a number of posts on calculating hours for different type of shift work. I can't remember other specific examples, but I do notice this pattern from time to time.



Not waves perhaps but several times I have solved non-trivial problems, maybe even hard and "unique" ones just to see a remarkably similar problem being posted from another part of the world a short time after, sometimes just 5 minutes. I don't think there is a connection, I think it's just that randomness isn't as even as I picture it in my head.

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## Doc.AElstein

> .... or my brain is making connections, much like........



when a Film comes on the Telly, I often think.. B**ger me!, I was thinking about that film just the other day




> Yes, it kida has got way off track from the OP's topic



... coming “back” a bit....



> . .. it is forum where members (developers or not) hand out solutions for free...Bottom line here is that, no matter what your view, background, preferences etc, this remains a free forum, where members come for free assistance - be that "teach me to fish" or just plain "catch a fish for me".....



..Some people make no secret about it, using forums like these to do all their work, always asking, never giving, - just one of many:
http://www.mrexcel.com/forum/search....archid=3014526
http://tinyurl.com/nfqahg6
.  Even seen them “Bump” after an hour with “Hey I need this for my Work!!!”....at least they are honest and “stay real” as I say.. ( Puzzles me slightly that they often get quick responses )
.....
Bottom line for me is I just I get a ( little ) bit annoyed by the Anonymous one Threaders that “vanish “ after a good answer ( at least in that current Anonymous name). But that is partly  just because due to my ( lack ) of ability, I only am left to answer the tedious but less technically challenging Threads. But I always take the liberty of trying something a bit new when I answer, even if it does not give the best solution, so I learn a bit.  ( I suppose I could give a really smelly Fish, I stumbled on a way to “crash”  an EF Thread the other day, but it is against my principals to do that -  )
*.FWIW. a last comment, it would be nice if at least some “legality” could be required for members when registering.* That is why the diversion to people “outing” in this Thread I found cool
Alan
P.s. 




> ...... see a remarkably similar problem being posted from another part of the world a short time after, sometimes just 5 minutes. I don't think there is a connection,......



... maybe another way to "bump" anonymously.....I have caught out and reported OP's several times that ask a mate somewhere else in the world to either answer their Thread to "bump" it, or ask a similar question to "bump" the Theme..

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## Jacc

Nah, I don't think so in my cases. There has been cases that happened right after the first problem was solved. Also the problems have been way different, only the solution has been very similar in concept. I think it's just one of those weird random things.

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## Tony Valko

> http://www.mrexcel.com/forum/search....archid=3014526



That seems to be a dead link. I get this message:





> vBulletin Message
> 
> 
> Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms.

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## Doc.AElstein

Hi,




> That seems to be a dead link. I get this message:



Ahh, I think you need to log in, if you are registered there, ( It is MrExcel Forum ), - It was just an OP example that sprung to mind and I did not pay  attention as to where it was, sorry about that. Basically it is just an OP that asks endless questions, often bumping after a short amount of time, and often freely admits he knows nothing and wants someone to do his work for him. He gets lots of help. I have at least a little bit of repect that he is honest and stays "real", - the point I had brought up a bit in this Thread

Alan

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## Kyle123

No, it's because the searches are cached and they expire, to get the search url right click on the link to show started threads and copy that. You can't got to it and then copy the url.

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## Doc.AElstein

> .... to get the search url right click on the link to show started threads and copy that. You can't got to it and then copy the url.



.  Ok , sorry to make a mess. The OP is Dazzawm .... This is link as you suggested:

Find latest posts

.. seems to work for me when copied to WORD ... 
 But not when I copy it here - . It only copies in as simple text... 

... I think what you suggest  only works with the Enhanced Interface - Full WYSIWYG Editing which EF Forum does not appear to have in
>> setting  >>> general settings   >>>  Message Editor Interface:

... I just did it at Mr excel and with ( and only with  Full WYSIWYG Editing  )  it works..
http://www.mrexcel.com/forum/test-he...l?#post4239384

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## Kyle123

I'm not really sure what you're trying to do, simply:

Then paste in the textbox?

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## Doc.AElstein

> I'm not really sure what you're trying to do, simply:
> ......
> Then paste in the textbox?



.. Thanks kyle, I did exactly that....   I updated / editted my Post #44 as you posted Post # 45
EDIT
... try again  .. My browser does not give exactly the same options as yours... I have an option for the address:
http://www.mrexcel.com/forum/search....t&showposts=1&
http://tinyurl.com/nfqahg6
EDIT EDIT - well that last one seems to work, at least now.... whether it expires later?

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## Kyle123

It definitely didn't work  :Wink:

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## Doc.AElstein

> It definitely didn't work



.. Still works for me. The usual different Browser Stuff. Anyways i have distracted the Thread again too much, sorry about that. 
The OP name is Dazzawm and, maybe one of these links will work for some people.
http://www.mrexcel.com/forum/search....t&showposts=1&
http://www.mrexcel.com/forum/search....BForum_Thread&
http://www.mrexcel.com/forum/search....t&showposts=1&
http://www.mrexcel.com/forum/test-he...l?#post4239384
http://www.mrexcel.com/forum/test-he...l?#post4239384
http://www.mrexcel.com/forum/search....t&showposts=1&
http://tinyurl.com/nfqahg6

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## Jacc

When I click any of your links the 5 dots in the middle show up in my browser address bar exactly like they do in your post. I think the dots are placeholders for information that simply isn't there.

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## Kyle123

The first & second ones works for me

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## Doc.AElstein

> The first & second ones works for me



... we could play around for ever I guess.... It seems to be very dependant on when , how  , you copy paste ( selecting the different options to paste and copy , right mouse click or Ctrl C , Ctrl V  etc.. etc...   Another experienced Pro ( RickXL ) once said to me that down the road of trying to figure out which  version of the clipboard is / if  used leads to madness...
.  .. and editing posts confuses further when sometimes that changes things etc. etc.. etc...
.   But I have noticed that the lack of the 3rd editor option at EF reduces the chances of "sucess".

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## Jacc

Maybe this? http://tinyurl.com/

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## Doc.AElstein

> Maybe this? http://tinyurl.com/



.... the following is made via Tiny ( A link that kyle said worked ... and Jacc said was incomplete.....)
http://tinyurl.com/nfqahg6
( In the Editor it shows to me as a link to Tiny site
EDIT Works for me. But always, like the Image Issue, using external sites often helps...  in the short term... but the consequences in the future.... junk mail, or other virusis sneaking in when you access external sites?? But thanks for the Tip, got the Tiny link stored, might help sometimes getting over URL problems in the future. :Smilie:

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## Jacc

Yup that works.

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## quekbc

what were we discussing about again?

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## Doc.AElstein

> what were we discussing about again?



Ha Ha  :Smilie: .... :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): ....  About being "real"

. (   If this was not the Water colors, JBeaucaire  would have wiped out most of these Posts!!!  )

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## FDibbins

And maybe we need to get back on track with taht - unless that discussion is ended?  :Wink:

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## Doc.AElstein

> And maybe we need to get back on track with taht .....



.  Sorry about my diversions , but the “outing” of the “real” people was nice.




> ..... - unless that discussion is ended?



.. maybe a quick attempt at redemption, back to the original OP ...  and general Theme...
.....




> Hi,
> .  I actually fully agree with your sentiments, ........
> ....
> .......
> . P.s – the last thread you criticised from danfullwood, is exactly the sort of Thread I have usually been able to / left to answer in the past. Except mostly they were considerably bigger and more complicated!!!, and I had a big struggle initially to get the OP to produce  reduced sample data as danfullwood has already done.  So I may be tempted to have a go at that one, as a “quicky” ( relatively speaking for the Threads I have answered of that nature!!)............ ...!



.. well I did...a few days back....
http://www.excelforum.com/excel-prog...ml#post4154341
.. ...  and...
.       *= “”* 


(... Sort of supports the OP, his criticisms, my comments about the anonymous “One Threaders” etc. , but I have seen in the meantime the other extreme of great feedback also...
http://www.excelforum.com/excel-prog...ml#post4156085
... )
... That’s life, “Up and Down” :Smilie: 
Alan Elston
Old Physisist, no idea about Computing, learning VBA to help with personal Project. "Stuck out in the Bavarian Hills" etc. etc.

P.s.
.. A last thought on encouraging “Being real”..   I know that the Forum software checks for unique usernames at an E-mail address. But that means nothing: I know nothing about computers but can create a valid email in about a minute. And there is no  limit to the number I can make, (all free). I am sure most people can automate that to do it at a click, ( or at a F5..)..  But what is this “IP” thing ? Is that “unique”? If more than a few people at an “IP” registered , could the software then require / ask for some legitimacy?? Or can one man make a IP easily?

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## FDibbins

Alan, to answer your question...




> But what is this “IP” thing ? Is that “unique”? ....







> An Internet Protocol address (IP address) is a numerical label assigned to each device (e.g., computer, printer) participating in a computer network that uses the Internet Protocol for communication. An IP address serves two principal functions: host or network interface identification and location addressing.
> 
> IP address - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IP_address
> 
> Wikipedia

----------


## Doc.AElstein

Hi FDibbins,
.



> Alan, to answer your question...



.. Thanks for the reply and info.
.  I had roughly got that idea from googling but was not too clear exactly , that is to say how "Unique" it is, - your quote along with the reference you gave could be interoperated to mean initially that each device / computer at "an address" might have a unique number- But I just tried a few computers simultaneously running by me here at home and then on each "googled" my IP address ( there are loads of free sites that give you your address ). The result was that all my Computers here have the same IP address ( I have some sort of splitter on the telephone cable coming through the wall from which I get my internet connection ). So clearly an IP address seems to refer to "a place" or a telephone line rather than a computer. – Similarly I have a couple of internet OSB “sticks” which i am able to get internet through. They both appear to have a different “unique” IP address. 
.  Getting back then to my original point: I suppose it could be legitimate to have lots of "valid" , that is to say "real" people using one IP address, for example at a large company with one or more main  “Lines” connected to the internet. 
. But I would think it would still be reasonable for a Forum such as Excelforum, say , after the 3 or 4th  registration at an IP address to ask for some legitimacy to the person registering. That is very reasonable considering the excellent free service the company would be receiving from help at the forum.
. However this was a minor point that I thought appropriate in this Thread to bring up.
. Just to clarify my reason for this: I expect many people abuse the forum by re registering with a made up email and username every time they want help. This disguises / hides any bad doings / poor feedback etc, they may have given at their last visit under a different email address and user name. Also I have clearly seen that statements similar to the following often result in an OP getting a better response ...."_ Hi, this is such a great forum , I have learnt so much already and can usually always find what  i want here, but this problem I just could not find, so i registered. Please can you help...._" 

. Alan

----------


## FDibbins

Just to feed into your question/comment above about multiple devices having the same IP, maybe this will also help...




> A subnetwork, or subnet, is a logical, visible subdivision of an IP network. The practice of dividing a network into two or more networks is called subnetting. Computers that belong to a subnet are addressed with a common, identical, most-significant bit-group in their IP address.
> 
> Subnetwork - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subnetwork
> 
> Wikipedia

----------


## Doc.AElstein

> Just to feed into your question/comment above about multiple devices having the same IP, maybe this will also help...



.. Thanks again, - mine "divides up" into about 8 I think, I guess a big company could somehow divide up to lots, ...
Alan

----------


## FDibbins

any time, and thanks for the feedback  :Smilie:

----------


## quekbc

I'm no expert in networking, but here is what I understand. 

The ISP (Internet Service Provider) assigns you an IP address. This assignment of IP addresses are generally done in 2 ways. First type is a static IP. That is, every time you connect to the internet (imagine the dial-up sound of a 56k modem), you get the same IP address. The other type is called a dynamic IP address. That is, every time you connect to the internet (dial-up model sound again), you get a different IP - generated from a set of IP address that the ISP holds.

In the case of static IP, yes, they are "tied" to a "place" - sometimes to an "account" (i.e. if and when you move houses but maintain the same account, they keep the IP for you).

In terms of legitamising accounts, it's a difficult thing to do. A person may have signed up to an ISP that assigns dynamic IPs (i.e. multiple IPs at different points in time to the same person). Someone can choose to have multiple accounts with multiple ISPs - so a "place" can have multiple IP addresses. Or, they can connect to a separate server using a VPN, thus showing up as the server's IP rather than their own (e.g. you connect to your office computer, and use the office's internet).

Not that any of this helps the process of legitamising accounts - but its a glimpse into how difficult it can be. Common methods that I know of in trying to "uniquely" identify computers are through things like cookies, which most browsers nowadays can clear / block the use of cookies).

----------


## Doc.AElstein

> I'm no expert in networking, but here is what I understand. .....



.  
 .   Thanks for that. 
.  Clearly legitimising accounts is not as easy as I was thinking. And "turning a blind eye" is one way to help "get the membership quota up" anyway  - so it is not something the powers that be would want to push...
...  I do not mean that as undue criticism. I have greatly benefited from ( free ) help here, so I have no right to criticise how they may help to make the Forum attractive to companies advertising here etc...in order to finance the Board...
.  I just find it a shame when regulars are abused for freely sharing the benefit of their knowledge and experience by un serious users, or people just to lazy to learn do their homework or  re contribute back to the board..  – the original jist of this Thread..
. Alan

----------


## quekbc

Understandable, Alan. I myself am more irked by an earlier post where someone fake requested IT support from a third party consultant only to find the question posted right back here by someone else - presumably the consultant.

Whilst I am happy answering some of the queries, I don't know how to feel knowing that some of the solutions are being used by someone else for a quick buck.

----------


## FDibbins

I guess that goes with the territory, not all members have the same ethical standards.  For myself, I am here to help, in just about any way I can - after a while here, you get to know many of the members, and can sometimes tell when a member is just "using" us.  

It all boils down to - if you dont feel comfortable/willing to help a particular thread - or even member - leave it and move on  :Smilie:

----------


## quekbc

> It all boils down to - if you dont feel comfortable/willing to help a particular thread - or even member - leave it and move on



Most definitely, but it still irks me nonetheless. It's a cold world out there (and in here).

----------


## Doc.AElstein

> ......
> It all boils down to - if you dont feel comfortable/willing to help a particular thread - or even member - leave it and move on



.. I agree with that  also. Just surprised sometimes that some members who clearly ask daily many unrelated questions without feeding back much get good quick answers, even when bumping quickly... and then some who contribute what they can often get no response...  sometimes..
Alan

----------


## Kyle123

The problem with IP addresses is that they change all the time, the IP address you have now can change at any point (unless you've paid extra for a static IP address) so IP filtering doesn't really work. 

What would legitimacy look like for someone registering, all you can possibly verify about someone is their email address - and this verification is already done

----------


## Kyle123

Oops, didn't see this third page when I posted that

----------


## Doc.AElstein

> .......
> What would legitimacy look like for someone registering, all you can possibly verify about someone is their email address - and this verification is already done



.. it was not a big point,. I think I get the point now  verifying legitimacy is difficult, if not impossible
Alan
P.s. - I remember hearing that when you register with Microsoft for the "free" VB 2010, then after 30 days you can only continue to use it by giving a lot of personal details, home address etc. But I confess that sort of "spying" on me I do not like.
. It is a very difficult Theme. .. I guess if you insisted on logging in to use the site at all and you and your "visits" were logged, then it would put people off, effect "clicks" on the site, and reduce popularity with people looking for sites in which to advertise. 
.  I think I have laboured this point a bit much.
. Bottom line it just can't be done. And as often commented, it is just down to the individual to decide who he / she helps... No way of getting over that. And what goes on behind the scene that makes some persistent takers who never give, but always receive lots of help...  no idea there, maybe some people know each other outside the forum and “pay in kind” or whatever,.. no idea.
.  
.  As far as I am concerned I am just going to give as much good feedback as I can to the people who are kind enough to help me, try to make threads i start useful for others, and ( for now, until I get better, ) still answer the difficult but not technically challenging Threads, that inevitably will have a higher proportion of people just trying to get their work done freely...  But it is not always the case as.. I also mentioned a lot before.

----------


## Doc.AElstein

> Oops, didn't see this third page when I posted that



Happens to me a lot.
.I would prefer to get notified of all post in a thread I am subscribed to. But Other's wouldn't. I do not think there is a setting to mofify that?. I think the usual statment is 
_...."..There may also be other replies, but you will not receive any more notifications until you visit the forum again..".._

----------


## xladept

Hi Doc,

Thanks for the information on Windows 10 - anything else about it that we should know? :EEK!:

----------


## Doc.AElstein

> Hi Doc,
> 
> Thanks for the information on Windows 10 - ...:



yous welcome.., I will keep my ears open if case any thing else is said about it on the news..  
Alan


https://www.verbraucherzentrale-rlp....etzten-klick-1
http://tinyurl.com/pzqkogg

P.s.
( Did you accidently post in the wrong thread ? .. did you mean to post here
http://www.excelforum.com/microsoft-...0-upgrade.html
)
P.P.s.  one extra small strange thing...
. A few years back I got a LG x120 Notebook for my Wife.. It only had Windows 7 STARTER version ( A scaled down version of Windows 7 ) At the shop they said the Note Book was only really good with XP and the Full Windows 7 probably would not run on it.....and I would have to pay for it...     Today on that Notebook the Window keeps comin up asking me to instal ( for free ) Windows 10... Strange

----------


## xladept

Hi Doc,

I didn't know about that other thread - thanks for the link :Smilie: 

My life has been a catalogue of unawareness :EEK!:

----------


## BellyGas

Seriously?   

http://www.excelforum.com/excel-prog...to-sheet2.html

----------


## Doc.AElstein

Hi,
.    Âand you can expect spending ten times as long as necessary to get the simplest point across because of language differencesÂ.
.   Â just try amusing yourself if you take on such ThreadsÂ..
http://www.excelforum.com/non-englis...ml#post4176824
http://www.excelforum.com/excel-prog...ml#post4165120

----------


## BellyGas

> SpoonFeedADonkeyWanks.xlsm



 :Smilie:   LOL LOL LOL.  *applause*

----------


## daffodil11

These "outings of the real people" are my favorite threads on the forum.

It goes to show that deep down inside, we're not just a bunch of cantankerous old men. Sometimes, we can smile too.

Also, the DonkeyWanks thread is comedy gold.

----------


## Kyle123

How come DonkeyWanks hasn't had the forum censor police all over it yet?

----------


## daffodil11

I think my greatest offenses are when someone posts an image of something highly complex and involved with no workbook.

And then in moments of controlled fury, I replicate the entire workbook from scratch with the desired result, and post a picture of it.

Kind of like this:
Capture2.jpg

----------


## Doc.AElstein

> ... moments of _controlled fury_, I replicate the entire workbook from scratch with the desired result, and post a picture of it.....



.  Hey I like that, I guess my _controlled fury_ is trying to amuse myself..

----------


## Kyle123

@daffodil, that's nothing - I've seen users draw and take a photo of their workbook and upload that...

----------


## JBeaucaire

> How come DonkeyWanks hasn't had the forum censor police all over it yet?



Consider me here, now.  I find this thread hilarious, and even more so I find it sad.

Humor at the expense of an OP is a breach of rule 6b.   If you can't help in a thread without remaining respectful and courteous at all times, then walk away from the thread, courteously.  

I know the OP seems ignorant of the fact that he is being made fun of right to his face.  Hilarious.  And offensive beyond doubt.  Much of humor  is funny because it is offensive, this is prime example.

So, let me be clear.  Do not make fun of OPs in the forum in any manner that they could ever see.  It is discourteous to lay an insult at someone's feet and "hope" they don't see it.

So stop it.

----------


## JBeaucaire

> I think my greatest offenses are when someone posts an image of something highly complex and involved with no workbook.
> 
> And then in moments of controlled fury, I replicate the entire workbook from scratch with the desired result, and post a picture of it.



I admit to having done this once or twice in the past.  No more.  Its funny, but if I'm going to spend time AND help others who may find the thread in the future, I need to behave in my answers.  If I take the time to create a workbook now, I post it.  Usually I thank them for the detailed pic and ask for the workbook, which is the courteous teaching approach.

----------


## JBeaucaire

> Hi,
> .    …and you can expect spending ten times as long as necessary to get the simplest point across because of language differences….
> .   … just try amusing yourself if you take on such Threads…..
> http://www.excelforum.com/non-englis...ml#post4176824
> http://www.excelforum.com/excel-prog...ml#post4165120



The correct thing to do in a thread where the OP is struggling with the English is to answer in perfect English.  Correct examples of the language they are struggling to learn is helpful, incorrect examples simply reinforce their current errors.  This is a teaching forum and in all things we are teaching good things.  So do that.

----------


## xladept

Amen - Jerry!

----------


## Kyle123

What I can never quite get my head round, is that it is quite common to see poor non-english speakers write in text speak. I can never quite make up my mind how they have learnt this; is it something they've learnt after English that makes their posts unnecessarily difficult to understand or is it how the'ye learnt English? It makes their posts often incomprehensible at best.

----------


## BellyGas

> This is a teaching forum and in all things we are teaching good things.  So do that.



A-bleedin-men. 

I think the first lesson that needs to be taught is how to use Google.

----------


## Doc.AElstein

> What I can never quite get my head round, is that ... poor non-english speakers write in text speak. ......




Hi,
. I sometimes try to reply in this strange “Text speak” back. I find sometimes that is the only way to get the message across and so  get there in the end. That is part of my “Third language” which often gets a solution where all and everyone else fails , ( or needs an unreasonable amount of time,  - so preventing them helping a lot more people as many very helpful regulars do here. I am always amazed how many threads many regulars answer.- about 100 to my 1 .* That is what really puts  me in my place* )

.  Maybe when the Google translator gets a bit better all will be good. 
.  I speak and can almost write fluently in my main two languages,  English and German. I find the Google translator very useful. Helps me with my terrible spelling and gives me half the sentence to then further work on. I do not think it is yet at the level that it can be used on its own, although I frequent see in Threads here that the OP attempts that.

.  I need to perfect my “Third language” to get it more universally acceptable. I hope to do so. I like to help in any way I can. If I can amuse myself at the same time I try, but I should not do that at the OP’s expense, I guess..  Maybe it was OK to call George a Wanker, in the DonkeyWanks Thread. I know he is, and he is proud of it. There are proved health advantages to wanking. I should not, however,  have insulted the Donkey, inferring he should be wanked. I apologize for that. I am an animal lover myself, ( as  far as the Wife permits )

.  Alan

----------


## JBeaucaire

> What I can never quite get my head round, is that it is quite common to see poor non-english speakers write in text speak. I can never quite make up my mind how they have learnt this; is it something they've learnt after English that makes their posts unnecessarily difficult to understand or is it how the'ye learnt English? It makes their posts often incomprehensible at best.



I agree.  Again, as courteously as I can, I request OPs to not use text speak when I encounter it.  

As a moderator I'm able to actually edit their posts to remove it and replace it with regular words, then point it out and ask they do the same. Maybe just click the REPORT button when you see it so you don't have to feel responsible for dealing with those peripheral issues.   :Cool:

----------


## daffodil11

> A-bleedin-men. 
> 
> I think the first lesson that needs to be taught is how to use Google.



I always assumed this is what most problem solvers here do. Asking the internet the right question is the hardest part though.

When I run into VB 6.0 and Access roadblocks, I feel like an idiot all over again, Google'ing 'Why are there jet engines in my Access database"

----------


## TMS

If I'm honest, I often Google the problem, and sometimes just post the relevant links, or a selection. To be fair, as you say, the most difficult part is knowing what to Google.

However, I do get a little frustrated sometimes when it appears no effort has been made ... and you see the same or similar questions near each other in the forum thread list.  Classic: how do I hide rows based on the contents of cells in column A, or whatever?

----------


## quekbc

www.lmgtfy.com is my best friend nowadays.

----------


## Doc.AElstein

> What I can never quite get my head round, is that it is quite common to see poor non-english speakers write in text speak.



...... Our Friend "Brain ache" is back... might 'ave another go....
http://www.excelforum.com/excel-prog...ml#post4165110
http://www.excelforum.com/excel-prog...ml#post4182395

----------


## Missus Mommabear

I hope this post helps with frustrations.

When I first started here I knew diddly squat and never wanted the 'solution' but the right road to take to get there myself, I wanted to learn and understand.
I found myself in a position at work where I wanted to deliver things I knew I had little to no knowledge about, but I am a self driven a highly motivated person who learns best with trial and error, but when I found myself at a solid wall with no direction to go this forum helped me.

The help and support and direction I have been offered on this forum has been truly amazing and I have appreciated every second that people have taken to assist me and I have learnt so much it is awesome.

Dont get me wrong if someone had given me the 'exact' reams of code I required my delivery of so much would have been so much faster, but I would still have been an excel dimwit as I was at the beginning, I am still a novice, but what I know I now know well and with confidence and can teach and share with others and know what I am offering is quality.

I can thank only the amazing boys and girls here to offer their time and knowledge, some of us REALLY appreciate it.So thank you seems inadequate, but it is very sincere.

I also completely understand the frustration albeit from a different place. I have spent years training my horses for competion, hours of blood (literally) broken bones (literally) sweat and tears, in all weathers and at stupidly early and late hours of the day and when some says, 'Oh you have horses, I rode once can I have a go' I want to punch them, because that is sooooo not how it works, my horses would kill them because of their lack of knowledge. I would be and have been happy to help and teach and suppport them achieve equine goals, but never hand anything on a plate.

This may be two different experiences but I know the frustration you feel so wanted to let you know that some of us, really do learn and want to and appreciate every second you offer us.

----------


## JBeaucaire

Thanks for your thoughts, we are so glad we've been able to help push you along your Excel learning curve.

There is a significant difference between someone coming to your place of hard-earned skill and show and acting all "in the know", thus disrespecting what you do and have done.... and those coming here to a place of asking where free assistance is happily offered and find themselves talked down to or abused by the very people supposedly "happily helping".

Here, I am frequently having to remind our helpers that the free help freely given IS the reward, and the OPs ultimately don't really owe us anything.  Help where you can, or move on to other threads, but avoid wherever possible becoming overly harsh or ill-mannered with an OP, even if they may deserve it, a little.   :Wink:

----------


## Doc.AElstein

> .......
> Here, I am frequently having to remind our helpers that the free help freely given IS the reward, and the OPs ultimately don't really owe us anything.  Help where you can, or move on to other threads, but avoid wherever possible becoming overly harsh or ill-mannered with an OP, even if they may deserve it, a little.



Understood. I think I have more that “redeemed myself” in the last few days with any OP’s I may have offended, bringing them to a final solution where sometimes, everyone else failed….   Even if they may not have fully deserved it… :Wink: 
Alan

----------


## JBeaucaire

And thus, that IS the satisfaction we all seek.  Good job!  _(thumbs up)_

----------


## Missus Mommabear

I do agree though that an idiot is an idiot and should not be tarred with a non idiot brush for the sake of niceness, besides it leaves said idiots becoming disillusioned into believing they are not in fact idiots, when clearly they are  :Smilie:  :EEK!:  :Smilie:

----------


## JBeaucaire

But it will never be clear the THEM, so let's help them keep their secret.  hehe.

----------


## xladept

What they don't know can't hurt them :Smilie:

----------


## thbuster

Some of us are trying to learn from you.  Thanks for teaching!

----------


## JBeaucaire

> Some of us are trying to learn from you.  Thanks for teaching!



That's the important comment in this thread so far.

----------


## BellyGas

> I do agree though that an idiot is an idiot and should not be tarred with a non idiot brush for the sake of niceness, besides it leaves said idiots becoming disillusioned into believing they are not in fact idiots, when clearly they are



clap clap clap clap clap clap

----------


## Doc.AElstein

.. maybe a compromise acceptable to us all is wot i have recently done at relavent points in a Thread Reply.... 



> "....I needed a macro here that is so simple it could write it with the macro recorder.."..  
>  .. so here it is... and  then i modified it a bit ... " etc.



_   Leaves it open to interpretation  :Wink: , helps me remember with a bit of amusement this Thread  :Smilie: ...... and hey, I still learn sometimes ( or if I an Honest, Mostly ) from what the macro recorder spews out..

----------


## TMS

Nothing wrong with the macro recorder, or using it, at all.  I regularly record a specific action to get the core code and then modify it to make it generic and/or specific to the requirement.  There's way too much stuff that I don't know off by heart, or even well enough, to be able to just write it out.

----------


## JBeaucaire

Yep, I use it almost daily.

----------


## daffodil11

It's especially helpful to me when I'm working out a solution involving objects I know very little about. 

Like Printing, Headers, Dialog boxes. I'd be lost without the Object Browser or Macro Recorder.

----------


## xladept

The macro recorder is indispensible :Smilie:

----------


## judgeh59

It's on my QAT

----------


## BellyGas

[PUNT]

Cos God daaaaamn:  http://www.excelforum.com/excel-prog...r-daybook.html

----------


## Doc.AElstein

He probably thinks his infraction is a compliment and is totally puzzled why he got a week ban from MrExcel...........

What does your PUNT mean ?
_....


 :Confused: 
 :Confused: 
 :Confused:  EDIT: ( I think I can put this bit back in from what was censored !  :Smilie: 
.....    -  it could just be innocent language miss – understanding to some extent. It shows a lot of the signs for that. .. I have answered a lot worse.  He seems very polite. 

I think we  could definitely do with the Forum Rules written in Hindi ....

----------


## JBeaucaire

PUNT means "kick".   Either "kick this person" or "kick the ball downfield to the other team, I give up."

----------


## AliGW

> He probably thinks his infraction is a compliment ...



I can assure you that he knows it isn't.  :Cool:

----------


## FDibbins

> PUNT means "kick".   Either "kick this person" or "kick the ball downfield to the other team, I give up."



It is also a small, flat-bottomed boat, often propelled by a pole
 :Wink:

----------


## AliGW

> It is also a small, flat-bottomed boat, often propelled by a pole



And as a verb, it can also mean to have a bet on something, to stick your neck out a bit.  :Wink:

----------


## Doc.AElstein

_"please do the needful" ._  Lol...   He doesn’t give up, Bless him..   :Smilie: 

http://www.excelforum.com/excel-prog...ml#post4586035
http://www.excelforum.com/excel-prog...ml#post4586031

----------


## BellyGas

[PUNT] is a habit I picked up from another forum mainly populated by Yanks.  It's my understand a PUNT is something they do in that silly handball game that they call football, whereby the ball is PUNTED up the field.  It's useage on a forum is to indicate a thread being punted to the top.

----------


## Doc.AElstein

My answer was removed/  censored, - with hind sight quite correctly.  Apologise for that.  :Frown: 
 :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): 
I had, mistakenly,  initially thought you might have suggested that he was screwing about with someone in a bad way, as suggested by a transitive verb definition given a little way down at this site: 
 http://onlineslangdictionary.com/mea...nition-of/punt
I innocently hit on that definition first on a Google search. That tied up with that initial thought, I felt. 

I did not think he was doing that. 

Or at least I thought there was a chance that it may be down to difficulty speaking in English. I have since put a Suggestion for Improvement in that we get the Forum Rules translated into Hindu.
 http://www.excelforum.com/exceltip-c...ml#post4585819 
 Considering that the management are from the India area, and we clearly have many Indian OPs, I would have thought that was both a useful and fairly easy thing to do.  :Smilie:

----------


## Doc.AElstein

> ... lazy xxxx who want their work done for them with no brain engagement required. ....you want things done for you with no effort .....



Along those lines...   Just another  :EEK!:   :EEK!:   for the record... ( and this is the censored version !!! ) : - 
https://www.excelforum.com/excel-for...ml#post4603185 
But I think the way we handle these things sometimes is very commendable. It does take patience of a saint, and more time. 
I guess many first time OPs   just want a quick answer, and probably sometimes just want their work done for them. 
But it is in everyone’s interest, in my opinion,  to try and “educate”... certainly the helpers are trying very hard in that Thread..   A problem with a written media like Forums is that in a few cases , possibly like the OP in that Thread, it is difficult  to  give a somewhat harder lesson / education .. which might be a bit more efficient , if you know what I mean  :Wink:  , ...  so you really have to take the arrogance / insults,  and try to “convert” them ...  or just move on ..

----------


## BellyGas

And may I just add:  Quote from the thread linked above  "Dont respond to my post if your not offering to help. You clearly dont know how to do this either since your asking me what worked and what didnt. What a joke. [Offensive comment removed by moderator] and stay away from my post." / QUOTE

Jesus H. Christ

Fdibbins, you sir really do have the patience of a saint.

----------


## FDibbins

Both Jerry and I thank you all for your support and kind words, I would like to pass those same compliments on to all the mods (as well as gurus and experts) here who all do an outstanding job, often under very trying conditions.  

You just have to keep in mind that we are all here to help and to learn, and always remember that those we help, may not even be at a level where they even know what questions to ask - if you dont even know that a certain tool even exists, how would you know to ask how to use it?

We have rules on this forum - as do all similar forums, and we expect all members to abide by them.  They may not be the best around, some may need updating, changing, deleted, added, and not all members will (ever) agree to all of them, but gentle reminders of those rules, often goes a long way.

I know all members are expected to read those rules on joining, but honestly, how often does anyone really read things like that.  That being said, if no-one points out the expectation to follow a certain rule/way of doing things, then you simply wont know  :Smilie:

----------


## Doc.AElstein

Another example.. 
You go the extra mile_.....
https://www.excelforum.com/excel-for...ml#post4614578
_.. get there in the end  :Smilie:      ( and the OP still does not respond to mark the Thread as Solved .. :Frown: . Lol....       ) .. Oh well , move on   :Smilie:   :Smilie:     The extra tolerance, which sadly we pay for sometimes , is a nice characteristic of ExcelForum  :Smilie: 

Once in 100 it pays off  :Smilie:    ... http://imgur.com/BluqeTn http://imgur.com/1MbKutd   :-)

----------


## BellyGas

It doesn't count if you post it yourself Doc.  ;-)

I know, I know, I'm just taking the mickey.

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## Raphaelp

@BellyGas - This guy wants to hire you:

https://www.excelforum.com/excel-gen...ml#post4618989

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## Doc.AElstein

> ...This guy wants to hire you:...



I think that Thread has been tanked ( deleted ). I expected it probably would be. Probably the OP has been referred to Commercial Services?

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## AliGW

No, the OP has been banned as a spammer - he had posted the same on several other forums.

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## Doc.AElstein

> ..OP has been banned as a spammer - ...



Thanks for the info. I just assumed our Commercial Services would have been keen to take his money  :Smilie:   .   So if he was not serious then I geuss anyone who had read that and was considering contacting him should be careful... ( of course they shoulld not have done that anyway as the Rules are against others coming in an offerenng to pay for services from Members.., I think. As I undrstand it the  Commercial Services is where you go if you are considering paying for work done by Members here. I think anyone can  offer to pay to have stuff done there.)

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## AliGW

I didn't do the banning, but he would have had to go to commercial services with a specific query, so this was not a straightforward "take your query to commercial services" situation. Anyway, he's gone. Not going to discuss it any further!  :Wink:

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## Richard Buttrey

> No, the OP has been banned as a spammer - he had posted the same on several other forums.



Maybe I've missed somethimg since I've not read all 100+ threads but that doesn't appear to be the case given that Bellygas posted only 3 days ago? And the name certainly doesn't feature in the list of banned users. 

However if we can return to the original subject:





> "but I'm too lazy to use it."
> 
> Seeing more and more of these lately. This thread is my vent at lazy gits who want their work done for them with no brain engagement required. If you want to learn how to code VBA I'm more than happy to help, anyone who shares my love of logic loops and other geeky things is more than welcome to pick my brains. However, if you want things done for you with no effort on your part then......hire a VBA developer. I'm a VBA developer and my daily rate is around Â£350. Hint frikkin hint.



I think it raises an interesting, almost philosophical question about being able to generate code in a much simpler way. Why shouldn't a Macro Recorder+ be designed to simplify even more the creation of code. After all that's what all programming languages do to some extent or another in order to end up with binary machine code.

Just one suggestion but maybe the recorder could offer prompts for what should constitute a range that needs to be operated on. So instead of capturing an absolute A1 range as now it could perhaps prompt for a range name and any modifier like say the CurrentRegion property.

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## AliGW

> Maybe I've missed something since I've not read all 100+ threads but that doesn't appear to be the case given that Bellygas posted only 3 days ago? And the name certainly doesn't feature in the list of banned users.



Ooops! My mistake. You are right: the banned member was another doing something very similar. Sorry for the confusion!

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## Doc.AElstein

> . Why shouldn't a Macro Recorder+ ...



It is often said by a lot of Experieced people that the Macro recorder is really useful, - was also said in this Thread. Certainly I encourage new users to learn it how to use it. So you can understand the original Thread Point, - an awfal lot can be got from a Recording done when manually doing what you want a code to do....

Many of the modifications usually sensible to make to a code produced by the recorder , like removing the *Select* stuff and replacing *Active* stuff with a specific referrence are so common, such that an inteligenter  Macro Recorder+ certainly seems a good idea..
I think any help to get a good understanding of the whole way  Excel handels  relative and absolute referrencing and extending a referrence over an increasd cell range,  at an early stage would be very helpful also****, so an inteligent Macro  Recorder + to ask about what is wanted in that respect, as Richard suggested, woulld be very helpful.
I guess that sort of improvement should be possible in a new XL version, - I cannot imagine any backwards compatibility issues ??






**** https://teylyn.com/2017/03/21/dollar...1/#comment-191

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## philaugust2004

My VBA skiils are limited so I rarely offer any VBA help but I do follow threads to learn. For me this forum serves 2 purposes: to give help where I can and to learn where I can't help.
On the Macro recorder, I use it often to get the base code which I can then modify

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## TMS

To be fair, "macro recorder" is a bit of a shortcut, or even a misnomer, in that it produces a recorded macro based on key strokes. That is, you select a cell or range, or whatever, and you carry out an action.  Hence the .Select and subsequent Selection.

What would be useful is a post processor which could note such constructs and eliminate them. Probably not as easy as it sounds given varying indentations, etc.

As I've probably said elsewhere on several occasions, I use the macro recorder to get the basic constructs for actions I am less familiar with.

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## Richard Buttrey

...one thing I've never understood is why the designers of the macro recorder decided it was necessary to include all the default - usually False, parameters.

The Print macro code that's captured is a classic example. Rarely do I need to use any True parameters and therefore I end up deleting all the defaults in order to speed up the code.

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## Doc.AElstein

> .....never understood is why the designers of the macro recorder decided it was necessary to include all the default - ...



I didnÂt quite follow TrevorÂs point. As I understood there is very little design as such and I thought it somehow just *recorde*d what was being done. Similarly it *record*s on taking any action or adjusting anything the actual snap shot of all the settings after hitting *Enter*. ( At least that is what I ass-oomed *** ) So the full set of possible arguments are just recorded as they stand at that point in time. Hence you get all parameters even the default / True ones. It would be part of your macro recorder *+* idea I expect  , as a more intelligent recorder  , to get rid of those things. ( ***  In many actions we take with the recorder running, the recorder waits until we hit Enter then it takes in ( records )  all the stuff we may have filled in, in, for example a dialogue box, and at the same time takes in all the other options we did not change or check / uncheck etc... )

Sounds like a Macro recorder *+* could be a bit tricky. Usually Excel is very good at guessing correctly. But for a longer code recording  it might make a bad mistake. I guess it might need to test run itself and if it caused some errors it might need to guess again.. and again.. which could get a bit messy. We are still at the point  were Humans are needed to sort out a computer programming mess I think.

If there was a macro recorder *+* , which I think is a great idea, then I would be keen to still have the present one as well. I find it very good in learning, or for saving you having to clutter your brain with memorising too many things: For one thing it is the arguments, and as Trevor said, the basic constructs,  that often , even much later in your career,  you are glad to get quickly from a quick, short macro recording. In this case  you would probably want it  to give you exactly what is there, rather than a guessed modification. 


I always say to an OP that we have to ÂseeÂ , so select things in order to do stuff in Excel. Hence a simple recording of our actions contains a lot of *Activate*ing and *Select*ing and doing stuff with the *Selection*.  I then go on to say that Excel does not need that. It can get most of its information from a *Range* object, and do what you want to do, by making changes to *Range* objects. So then that leads on nicely to explaining to the taking out of those *Activate*/ *Select* and With *Selection* bits, and modifying the code as such so that it  deals directly with the  ranges that were being seen and selected by me as I performed actions when the recorder was running.

If there was a macro recorder *+* *as well*  then so much the better_.....
_..... Then when an OP comes with a request that looks like he _.. needs a macro that is so simple it could be written with the macro recorder so that you would think the OP was too lazy to do it , but might not know too well the macro recorder.._.......
 :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):   ...   you could say,  _Â..Hey !,  ,  sounds like the macro recorder could be great at getting your code there.. !!  ...._..Â _... 
_................[ - then you click on the  Â how to do a macro recordingÂ.. canned reply in the Canned Replies drop down box to paste those instructions in - ] _..... then you say _..... 
_...Â _Try out the macro recorder and macro recorder + , see how you get on , have a go at modifying the code a bit , then if you still have problems post the code you have ( in code tags )  and explain in as much detail as you can where there problems lie, then someone will help you further_.   :Smilie:  ......

_. The OP likely wonÂt understand a word , but no matter, then try again and click on the canned reply written in Telugu and maybe you will get further  :Smilie: 
Alan 
 :Smilie:

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## Richard Buttrey

I saw a MacroRecorder+ as being in addition to the current version since as has been remarked it is extremely useful to be able to capture all the syntax that's available which is a vital tool in starting to understand macros. I say in addition but the current recorder could contain a pop up parameter when the 'Record Macro' button is pressed which asks if the user wanted the basic version or the + version.

As well as capturing key strokes the + version should be able to detect which objects are available and permit the user to open any UserForms or  other objects that are available. Then a logical extension would be for the recorder to ask the user (or somehow work out for itself) whether an object or cell needed to be populated with  a variable and if so prompt the user to define and then set the variable value.

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## Raphaelp

> Just one suggestion but maybe the recorder could offer prompts for what should constitute a range that needs to be operated on. So instead of capturing an absolute A1 range as now it could perhaps prompt for a range name and any modifier like say the CurrentRegion property.



The macro recorder in my excel has an option to use relative references rather than A1 notation. So that's a step.

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## Richard Buttrey

> The macro recorder in my excel has an option to use relative references rather than A1 notation. So that's a step.



Thanks for pointing out the obvious. I'm ashamed to say in the hundreds of times I've probably used the recorder I've never noticed that. A case of familiarity breeding contempt I think

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## Doc.AElstein

Hi Raphaelp, Hi Richard




> The macro recorder in my excel has an option to use relative....



I think It was one of the first things I read in an old book on VBA, ::_..
_..and I see it daily, _..
ViewRelRec.JPG http://imgur.com/gsnt4zM 
DevToolsRelRec.JPG http://imgur.com/XgwxabR 
_..  but forgot about it  !!!
_. Most blogs on the macro recorder show it, but I have not seen any comment on it  EasyRecord Macro button DevTools.JPG http://imgur.com/EwmeSK0 http://www.excel-easy.com/vba/exampl...-recorder.html 
*Alan*


*P.s. Raphaelp*
P.s. 1) You can swap from one to the other as you go along.. ***This code I got from a macro recording. I changed to relative recording in the middle of what I was doingg, ( I added 'comments, but the code I have not changed. The code is what the macro recorder gave me  )


```
Please Login or Register  to view this content.
```


( Note in passing that you can remove *.Range("A1")* in that code snippet above and it has no effect – you are not referring to cell A1, you are using the *Range(“ “)* Property of A1 relative to where you are, ( If you had B1 instead there, that  would take you one across from where you was ( which is M20 )  to cell N20. You see the macro recorder is doing a sort of relative referencing with A1 Relative to where you are – which is where you are, relatively speaking, as I am, as it was, the macro recorder was.... relatively speaking, recording stuff, relatively , ...So *.Range("A1")*  Property is redundant
 :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):  Might be worth just taking time to look at this again, - it is worth getting it straight, in my opinion. *Try this:*
_ Without *Use Relative Recording* selected, start a macro recording. Select some cell in active  worksheet , say cell K20. Now select cells K20 through L21. absoluteRecordingK20L21.JPG http://imgur.com/ZNLIzfw     As possibly expected, the macro recorder gives you the last selection before you did anything to the selection, and just returns a single line of *Range("K20:L21").Select* . Stop the recording. ( Code Makro8 below is what you should get )
_ Now , select again cell K20. Now select *Use Relative Referencing* and start a macro recording.  Now select cells K20 through to L21. If you are fairly new to Excel, then you might be surprised by the result here of what the recorder gives you: *ActiveCell.Range("A1:B2").Select* . Important to remember here is that that last code line *is* returns the Range object related to  cells K20:L21, *not* A1:B2. In the macro I got from this second recording ( Makro9  ) , I have added a few lines just to demo that.  ( .. and  ##   I did a quick demo on something else I explain later as well  ) 


```
Please Login or Register  to view this content.
```



P..s. 2) Excel is quite good at confusing with how it words these sort of things

2a) It labels one as macro recording / *Record Macro*  and the other as relative recording / *Use Relative References*. You would have thought that  should say something like relative macro recording and absolute macro recording. ***.  Note to switch between absolute and relative recording you toggle the relative recording button. I suppose technically you are switching relative on and off, that is why they label it as they do. But really you should be able to toggle between the two buttons one for relative  recording and one for absolute recording, as that I think is what you are doing .... absolutely, or relatively recording ( You will note also that to get relative recording from the start , then you must hit the *Record Macro* button first or after you select *Use Relative References*. So indicating that Excel is somehow thinking that it is an additional thing, which seems strange)


2b) Excel is very silly using
 A1 commonly for “Column letter and row number notation” 
and
R1C1 commonly for “Row number and column number notation”

A1 is actually relative referencing for/ To  the first cell  in “Column letter and row number notation”
and
R1C1 actually is absolute referencing for / To  the first cell in “row number and column number notation”



> .... relative references rather than A1 notation. So that's a step.



Be careful not to confuse 
*Notation*
And
*Referencing* ( absolute and relative )  

There are two forms of notation used in cell referencing

“Column letter and row number notation”

and

“Row number and column number notation”

Both these displayed notations can represent relative and absolute referencing. In the last code , Makro 9, ## I demoed this by giving you two message boxes. The first uses column Letter and row number notation. The second message box uses row number and column number notation. For both, I selected absolute referencing for the row, and relative referencing for the column 

https://teylyn.com/2017/03/21/dollarsigns/#comment-191
https://www.excelforum.com/developme...ml#post4618975 
https://www.excelforum.com/developme...ml#post4608252


P.s.3 ) 
Actually in our discussions here “Relative Referencing” is , I think , mainly referring to the use of the *.Offset* Property to return us a new Range object based on the Range object to which it is applied shifted a specific number of ( rows, columns ). This of course is another thing again. Well not really, relatively speaking: A Relative Thingies it is.
 :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):   :Smilie:

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## BellyGas

> Maybe I've missed somethimg since I've not read all 100+ threads but that doesn't appear to be the case given that Bellygas posted only 3 days ago? And the name certainly doesn't feature in the list of banned users.




Woah back, woah back.  I've been banned....?

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## Richard Buttrey

> Woah back, woah back.  I've been banned....?



No no. Fear Not.  :Smilie: 

See #133

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## Doc.AElstein

> Woah back, woah back.  I've been banned....?



We are talking about a Post/ New User, _.:-

A  new User started a Thread in which he was offering to pay for help with some Excel Work. 
In post # 127, Raphaelp  gave you a link to that Thread  post. 
But that post and Thread  has since been deleted. 
I do not know what happened to that new User. I cannot remember his name.
Alan

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## BellyGas

Good good, I can go back to whinging about bloody foreigners then, er...I mean our overseas friends.

I actually got an "oh yeah, good idea" today from someone I told to try the macro recorder....there's hope for em.

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## Doc.AElstein

Classic example I guess of not knowing whether the guy is being a really lazy ### and just can't be bothered .. or just does not understand a word anyone is saying ...  difficult to know I guess  ...
https://www.excelforum.com/excel-gen...at-a-time.html

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## AliGW

He understands all right. There was a post he made in that thread which he subsequently edited, in which he claimed only to have posted that query on this forum and nowhere else. He retracted that as soon as I posted the evidence. As he was unwilling to comply with the request I made, I closed the thread.

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## Doc.AElstein

> ...There was a post he made in that thread which he subsequently edited, in which he claimed only to have posted that query on this forum and nowhere else. He retracted that as soon as I posted the evidence....



Ahh that's different - certainly deserved to have his ( or her ) botty smacked  :Smilie: 
( I thought new OPs could not edit , - or I am probably confusing with another Forum where that is the case ? )

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## scottiex

As to original topic, I don't think the OP needs to worry too much there are plenty of us Â£0 people to answer the really dumb questions   :Smilie:  
Unless the asker is rude too too demanding - in which case he can do it himself.

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## Doc.AElstein

Hi scottiex,




> As to original topic, I don't think the OP needs to worry too much..Unless the asker is rude too too demanding - in which case he can do it himself.



As to the original OP/s that prompted the Thread.. I answered him/her and many similar for I guess getting on for well over a year. 
Dumb questions are not always too bad – an OP might be at the level of not knowing what / how to ask, having no idea what / how his answer could be answered – I think we have all been there ourselves. 
As for very demanding questions....   If you’re learning / not too clued up, but wanting to help you may  find more often answering the more demanding from “work” to be done, but less technically demanding. Feedback in those cases can be quite bad,  but if you want to / enjoy learning and enjoy answering Excel questions *then go for it*. 
From a learning point it can be great. I doubt most of us could ever learn all there is in something like Excel / VBA.

It is probably in everyone’s benefit though to try and “steer” the “bad” OPs a bit in the direction of being “better”, but it is very difficult to do that politely sometimes..  I think you really need to try that though... or they will probably come back  worse ... which is bad for everyone in the long run
Alan
 :Smilie: 


EDIT P.S.  Here ia another recent Thread on OPs and coutesy
https://www.excelforum.com/the-water...ps-and-qs.html

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## scottiex

Yes I very much agree Alan,

Although by demanding I mean when they start to complain that you are not answering quickly enough or otherwise start treating you like their employee. I think if you come to a website like this you have a duty to be very polite to the person who is doing you a significant favour and no right to complain if they drop you like a hot potato for being rude.

I know I am grateful for any assistance I get on here even if it only gets me one step closer to my solution because that is still a lot better than no steps closer and it is great to know there are people out there willing to help you just for the sake of being helpful (and for the sake of a well deserved click on that add reputation star!).

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